## Menachot Daf 7a

###### Menachot 7a:1
[Menachot 7a:1](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:1)

וְכִי מַהְדַּר לֵיהּ לְקוֹמֶץ לְדוּכְתֵּיהּ, (תִּקְדּוֹשׁ) [לִקְדּוֹשׁ] וְלִפְסוֹל.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**when he returns the handful to its** former **place** in the service vessel that contains the meal offering **it should become sanctified,** as it is now placed inside a service vessel, **and it should** therefore **become disqualified.** It should not matter whether the handful was placed in the vessel designated for it, or back in the same vessel it was taken from.


###### Menachot 7a:2
[Menachot 7a:2](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:2)

אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן, זֹאת אוֹמֶרֶת: כְּלֵי שָׁרֵת אֵין מְקַדְּשִׁין אֶלָּא מִדַּעַת.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
Concerning this challenge, **Rabbi Yoḥanan said: That is to say** that **service vessels sanctify** items placed in them **only** when they are placed there **with** specific **intent** that they be sanctified by that vessel. Since the priest does not return the handful to the vessel containing the meal offering with such intent, the handful is not disqualified, because the rite was not completed.


###### Menachot 7a:3
[Menachot 7a:3](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:3)

הָא מִדַּעַת מְקַדְּשִׁין? וְהָא בְּעָא מִינֵּיהּ רֵישׁ לָקִישׁ מֵרַבִּי יוֹחָנָן: כְּלֵי שָׁרֵת מַהוּ שֶׁיְּקַדְּשׁוּ פְּסוּלִין לְכַתְּחִילָּה לִיקְרַב? וַאֲמַר לֵיהּ: אֵין מְקַדְּשִׁין! אֲמַר לֵיהּ: אֵין מְקַדְּשִׁין לִיקְרַב, אֲבָל מִקַּדְּשִׁין לִיפָּסֵל.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara asks: It may be inferred from this statement that if items are placed into service vessels **with intent,** the service vessels **sanctify** them. **But** didn’t **Reish Lakish raise a dilemma before Rabbi Yoḥanan: What is** the *halakha* with regard to **service vessels,** i.e., do they **sanctify disqualified** items to the extent that they may be **sacrificed** upon the altar ***ab initio*? And** Rabbi Yoḥanan **said to him** that **they do not sanctify** the items. The Gemara responds: This is what Rabbi Yoḥanan **said to him: They do not sanctify** the disqualified items that are placed inside them **to** the extent that they may be **sacrificed, but they** do **sanctify** them **to** the extent **that** they **are disqualified.**


###### Menachot 7a:4
[Menachot 7a:4](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:4)

רַב עַמְרָם אָמַר: כְּגוֹן שֶׁהֶחְזִירוֹ לְבִיסָא גְּדוּשָׁה.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Rav Amram says:** Even if service vessels sanctify items without specific intent, it is possible to return the handful to the meal offering without the vessel sanctifying the handful, **such as** in a case **where he returned it to a heaped bowl [*levisa*],** i.e., he placed the handful upon the heap of flour in such a manner that the handful did not enter the airspace of the vessel containing the meal offering. Consequently, the handful is not sanctified by the vessel.


###### Menachot 7a:5
[Menachot 7a:5](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:5)

וּמִקְמָץ הֵיכִי קְמַץ? אֶלָּא, כְּגוֹן שֶׁהֶחְזִירוֹ לְבִיסָא טְפוּפָה.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara asks: **But** if the meal offering was heaped, **how** was he initially able to **remove a handful** from it? The handful must initially be removed from within a vessel. **Rather,** it is possible to return the handful without sanctifying it in a case **where he returned it to a full [*tefufa*] bowl,** i.e., it was full to the brim but not heaped. When the priest initially removes a handful from such a vessel, he removes it from inside the vessel, but when it is returned, it does not enter the airspace of the vessel.


###### Menachot 7a:6
[Menachot 7a:6](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:6)

וְכֵיוָן דִּקְמַץ לֵיהּ עֲבַד לֵיהּ גּוּמָּא, כִּי מַהְדַּר לְגַוֵּויהּ דְּמָנָא קָא מַהְדַּר לֵיהּ! מִכִּי מַהְדַּר לֵיהּ, מַנַּח לֵיהּ אַדֻּפְנָא דְּמָנָא, וּמְנִיד לֵיהּ וְנָפֵל מִמֵּילָא, דְּנַעֲשָׂה כְּמִי שֶׁהֶחְזִירוֹ הַקּוֹף.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara asks: **But once he removed a handful, he formed a furrow** in the surface of the meal offering, and therefore **when he returns** the handful to its previous place inside the vessel, **he is** in fact **returning it to** a spot **within the vessel,** i.e., the furrow. If so, the handful should be sanctified to the extent that the vessel disqualifies it. The Gemara responds: **When he returns it** to the vessel containing the meal offering, he does not place it directly in the furrow. Rather, he **lays it on the wall of the vessel and moves** the vessel, **and** the handful **falls by itself** into the furrow. In this manner, **it is as though a monkey** rather than a person **returned** the handful to the furrow, and the handful is therefore not sanctified.


###### Menachot 7a:7
[Menachot 7a:7](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:7)

אֲמַר לֵיהּ רַבִּי יִרְמְיָה לְרַבִּי זֵירָא: וְלוֹקְמַהּ כְּגוֹן שֶׁהֶחְזִירוֹ לִכְלִי הַמּוּנָּח עַל גַּבֵּי קַרְקַע! אֶלָּא, שְׁמַע מִינַּהּ קוֹמְצִין מִכְּלִי שֶׁעַל גַּבֵּי קַרְקַע? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: קָא נָגְעַתְּ בְּבַעְיָא דְּאִיבַּעְיָא לַן, דְּרַבִּי אֲבִימִי תָּנֵי מְנָחוֹת בֵּי רַב חִסְדָּא.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
§ The Gemara returns to its discussion of the opinion of ben Beteira. **Rabbi Yirmeya said to Rabbi Zeira: And let** one **interpret** ben Beteira’s ruling as speaking of a case in which the handful is not sanctified by the vessel containing the meal offering, **such as where he returned it to a vessel that is resting upon** the **ground. Rather,** the fact that this was not suggested indicates that service vessels sanctify items placed inside them even while resting on the ground. Is it correct to **conclude from** here that **one may remove a handful** of a meal offering **from** a service **vessel that** is resting **upon** the **ground?** Rabbi Zeira **said to him: You have touched upon a dilemma that was** already **raised before us, when Rabbi Avimi** was **learning** tractate ***Menaḥot*** in the **study hall of Rav Ḥisda.**


###### Menachot 7a:8
[Menachot 7a:8](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:8)

וַאֲבִימִי בֵּי רַב חִסְדָּא תָּנֵי? וְהָאָמַר רַב חִסְדָּא: קוּלְפֵי טָאבֵי בְּלַעִי מֵאֲבִימִי עֲלַהּ דְּהָא שְׁמַעְתָּא, בָּא לְהַכְרִיז רְצוּפִין – שְׁלֹשִׁים יוֹם, שֵׁנִי וַחֲמִישִׁי וְשֵׁנִי – שִׁשִּׁים יוֹם.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara interrupts this statement with a question: **And** did Rabbi **Avimi** really **learn** in the **study hall of Rav Ḥisda? But didn’t Rav Ḥisda say: I absorbed many blows [*kulfei*] from Avimi** as a result **of that *halakha*,** i.e., Avimi would mock me when I questioned his statements with regard to the sale of orphans’ property by the courts, which were contradictory to the ruling of a particular *baraita*. Avimi explained to me that if the court **comes to announce** such a sale on **consecutive** days, then it is announced for **thirty days,** in accordance with that *baraita*. But if it will be announced only on **Monday, Thursday, and Monday,** then it is announced over the course of **sixty days.** If so, Rav Ḥisda was in fact the pupil while Rabbi Avimi was his teacher.


###### Menachot 7a:9
[Menachot 7a:9](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:9)

אֲבִימִי מַסֶּכְתָּא אִיתְעֲקַרָא (אִיתְעֲקַר) לֵיהּ, וַאֲתָא קַמֵּיהּ דְּרַב חִסְדָּא לְאִדְּכוֹרֵי גְּמָרֵיהּ. וְלִישְׁלַח לֵיהּ וְלֵיתֵי לְגַבֵּיהּ? סְבַר: הָכִי מִסְתַּיְּיעָא מִילְּתָא טְפֵי.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara answers: **Avimi** was in fact the teacher, but **tractate** *Menaḥot* **was uprooted for him,** i.e., he forgot it, **and** Avimi **came before** his student **Rav Ḥisda to** help him **recall his learning.** The Gemara asks: If Rav Ḥisda was in fact Avimi’s student, **let** Avimi **send for him and** Rav Ḥisda **come to** Avimi. The Gemara responds: Avimi **thought** that **this** would be **more helpful** in this **matter,** i.e., that by exerting the effort to travel to his pupil in order to learn from him, he would better retain his studies.


###### Menachot 7a:10
[Menachot 7a:10](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:10)

פְּגַע בֵּיהּ רַב נַחְמָן, אֲמַר לֵיהּ: כֵּיצַד קוֹמְצִין? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: מִכְּלִי זֶה. אֲמַר לֵיהּ: וְכִי קוֹמְצִין מִכְּלִי שֶׁעַל גַּבֵּי קַרְקַע? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: דְּמַגְבַּה לֵיהּ כֹּהֵן.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara returns to the statement of Rabbi Zeira: **Rav Naḥman encountered** Avimi upon his return from the study hall of Rav Ḥisda. Rav Naḥman **said to him: How** does one properly **remove a handful** from a meal offering? Avimi pointed to a vessel that was resting on the ground and **said to him: From this vessel** one may properly remove a handful. Rav Naḥman **said to him: But may one remove a handful from a vessel that** is resting **upon** the **ground?** Avimi **said to him:** When I said that such a vessel may be used, I meant **that** one **priest** would first **raise it** from the ground and then another priest would remove a handful from it.


###### Menachot 7a:11
[Menachot 7a:11](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:11)

כֵּיצַד מְקַדְּשִׁין אֶת הַמְּנָחוֹת? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: נוֹתְנָהּ לִכְלִי זֶה. וְכִי מְקַדְּשִׁין בִּכְלִי שֶׁעַל גַּבֵּי קַרְקַע? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: דְּמַגְבַּה לֵיהּ כֹּהֵן.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
Rav Naḥman proceeded to ask Avimi another question: **How** does one properly **sanctify the meal offerings?** Avimi pointed to a vessel that was resting on the ground and **said to him:** The priest **places it into this vessel.** Rav Naḥman again said to him: **But can one sanctify** a meal offering **in a vessel that** is resting **upon** the **ground?** Avimi **said to him:** When I said that such a vessel may be used, I meant **that** another **priest** would initially **raise it** from the ground, and only then would the meal offering be placed inside it.


###### Menachot 7a:12
[Menachot 7a:12](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:12)

אֲמַר לֵיהּ: אִם כֵּן, הוּצְרַכְתָּה שְׁלֹשָׁה כֹּהֲנִים! אֲמַר לֵיהּ: וּתְהֵא צְרִיכָה שְׁלֹשָׁה עָשָׂר, כַּתָּמִיד.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
Rav Naḥman **said to** Avimi: **If so,** then **you require** the involvement of **three priests,** i.e., one to raise the vessel, one to sanctify the meal offering, and one to remove the handful from the meal offering. Avimi **said to him: And let it require** even **thirteen** priests, **just as** the service of the **daily** burnt **offering** required the involvement of thirteen priests. The need for several priests presents no difficulty.


###### Menachot 7a:13
[Menachot 7a:13](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:13)

אֵיתִיבֵיהּ: זֶה הַכְּלָל, כׇּל הַקּוֹמֵץ וְנוֹתֵן בִּכְלִי, הַמּוֹלִיךְ וְהַמַּקְטִיר, לֶאֱכוֹל דָּבָר שֶׁדַּרְכּוֹ לֶאֱכוֹל וְכוּ׳.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
Rav Naḥman **raised** another **objection** to the statement of Avimi from a mishna (12a) that discusses the *halakha* that improper intentions during the service of a meal offering disqualify it. **This is the principle:** In the case of **anyone who removes the handful, or places** the handful **in the vessel,** or **who conveys** the vessel with the handful to the altar, **or who burns** the handful on the altar, with the intent **to partake of an item whose** typical **manner** is such that one **partakes** of it, or to burn an item whose typical manner is such that one burns it on the altar, e.g., the handful or the frankincense, outside its designated area, the meal offering is unfit but there is no liability for excision from the World-to-Come [*karet*].


###### Menachot 7a:14
[Menachot 7a:14](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:14)

וְאִילּוּ מַגְבִּיהַּ לָא קָתָנֵי? תַּנָּא סֵדֶר עֲבוֹדוֹת נָקֵיט, וְלָא סֵדֶר כֹּהֲנִים.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
Rav Naḥman explained his objection: All the rites of a meal offering are taught in the mishna, **and yet raising** the vessel from the ground **is not taught.** This indicates that there is no requirement to raise a vessel from the ground in order to use it for the service of a meal offering. Avimi responded: The ***tanna* cited the order of** sacrificial **rites,** i.e., those rites concerning which improper intentions disqualify a meal offering, **but** he did **not** cite **the order of the priests,** i.e., he did not cite the total number of priests involved in the service.


###### Menachot 7a:15
[Menachot 7a:15](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Menachot/r/7a:15)

בְּעוֹ מִינֵּיהּ מִדְּרַב שֵׁשֶׁת: מַהוּ לִקְמוֹץ מִכְּלִי שֶׁעַל גַּבֵּי קַרְקַע? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: פּוֹק חֲזִי מָה עָבְדִין לְגָאו. אַרְבָּעָה כֹּהֲנִים נִכְנָסִין, שְׁנַיִם בְּיָדָם שְׁנֵי סְדָרִים, וּשְׁנַיִם בְּיָדָם שְׁנֵי בָּזִיכִין, וְאַרְבָּעָה מְקַדְּמִין לִפְנֵיהֶם, שְׁנַיִם לִיטּוֹל שְׁנֵי סְדָרִים, וּשְׁנַיִם לִיטּוֹל שְׁנֵי בָּזִיכִין.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
On the same topic, the Sages **raised a dilemma before Rav Sheshet: What is** the *halakha* with regard to the permissibility of **removing a handful from a vessel that** is resting **upon** the **ground?** Is this removal valid? Rav Sheshet **said to** one of the Sages who raised the dilemma: **Go out** and **see what they do within** the Sanctuary when they remove the bowls containing the frankincense that were placed upon the Table of the shewbread in order to burn the frankincense upon the altar. The mishna (99b) states: When the priests would replace the shewbread every Shabbat, **four priests** would **enter** the Sanctuary, **two** with the **two arrangements** of the new shewbread **in their hands and two** with the **two bowls** of frankincense **in their hands. And four** priests would **precede** them and enter the Sanctuary **before them, two to remove** the **two arrangements** of the old shewbread **and two to remove** the **two bowls** of frankincense.