## Rosh Hashanah Daf 3b

###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:1
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:1](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:1)

לְמִנְיָנָא אַחֲרִינָא הוּא? אָמַר רַב פָּפָּא: ״שְׁנַת עֶשְׂרִים״ ״שְׁנַת עֶשְׂרִים״ — לִגְזֵירָה שָׁוָה: מָה הָתָם לְאַרְתַּחְשַׁסְתְּא, אַף הָכָא לְאַרְתַּחְשַׁסְתְּא.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**it** follows some **other count. Rav Pappa said:** The meaning of the first instance of the expression **“the twentieth year”** may be inferred from the second instance of the expression **“the twentieth year” by way of a verbal analogy: Just as there** the reference is to the twentieth year **of Artaxerxes, so too, here** the reference is to the twentieth year **of Artaxerxes.**


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:2
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:2](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:2)

וּמִמַּאי דְּמַעֲשֶׂה דְּכִסְלֵיו קָדֵים, דִּילְמָא מַעֲשֶׂה דְּנִיסָן קָדֵים?

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara raises another question: Even though those two events took place in the same year, **from where** is it known **that the incident** that occurred **in Kislev took place first? Perhaps the incident** that occurred **in Nisan took place first,** in which case it is possible that even the years of gentile kings are counted from Nisan.


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:3
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:3](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:3)

לָא סָלְקָא דַּעְתָּךְ, דְּתַנְיָא: דְּבָרִים שֶׁאָמַר חֲנָנִי לִנְחֶמְיָה בְּכִסְלֵיו, אֲמָרָן נְחֶמְיָה לַמֶּלֶךְ בְּנִיסָן.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara answers: **It should not enter your mind** to say this, **as it is taught** in a *baraita*: **The words that Hanani told Nehemiah in** the month of **Kislev, Nehemiah told the king in** the month of **Nisan.**


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:4
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:4](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:4)

דְּבָרִים שֶׁאָמַר חֲנָנִי לִנְחֶמְיָה בְּכִסְלֵיו — שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״דִּבְרֵי נְחֶמְיָה בֶּן חֲכַלְיָה וַיְהִי בְחֹדֶשׁ כִּסְלֵיו שְׁנַת עֶשְׂרִים וַאֲנִי הָיִיתִי בְּשׁוּשַׁן הַבִּירָה. וַיָּבֹא חֲנָנִי אֶחָד מֵאַחַי הוּא וַאֲנָשִׁים מִיהוּדָה וָאֶשְׁאָלֵם עַל הַיְּהוּדִים הַפְּלֵיטָה אֲשֶׁר נִשְׁאֲרוּ מִן הַשֶּׁבִי וְעַל יְרוּשָׁלִָם. וַיֹּאמְרוּ לִי הַנִּשְׁאָרִים אֲשֶׁר נִשְׁאֲרוּ מִן הַשְּׁבִי שָׁם בַּמְּדִינָה בְּרָעָה גְדוֹלָה וּבְחֶרְפָּה וְחוֹמַת יְרוּשָׁלִַם מְפוֹרָצֶת וּשְׁעָרֶיהָ נִצְּתוּ בָאֵשׁ״.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The *baraita* explains: **The words that Hanani said to** Nehemiah **in Kislev** are **as it is stated: “The words of Nehemiah, son of Hachaliah: And it came to pass in the month Kislev, in the twentieth year, as I was in Shushan the capital, that Hanani, one of my brothers, came out of Judah, he and certain men; and I asked them concerning the Jews who had escaped, who were left of the captivity, and concerning Jerusalem. And they said to me: The remnant who are left of the captivity there in the province suffer much hardship and insult; and the wall of Jerusalem is broken down, and its gates are burned with fire”** (Nehemiah 1:1–3).


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:5
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:5](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:5)

אֲמָרָן נְחֶמְיָה לַמֶּלֶךְ בְּנִיסָן, שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״וַיְהִי בְּחֹדֶשׁ נִיסָן שְׁנַת עֶשְׂרִים לְאַרְתַּחְשַׁסְתְּא הַמֶּלֶךְ יַיִן לְפָנָיו וָאֶשָּׂא אֶת הַיַּיִן וָאֶתְּנָה לַמֶּלֶךְ וְלֹא הָיִיתִי רַע לְפָנָיו. וַיֹּאמֶר לִי הַמֶּלֶךְ מַדּוּעַ פָּנֶיךָ רָעִים וְאַתָּה אֵינְךָ חוֹלֶה אֵין זֶה כִּי אִם רֹעַ לֵב וָאִירָא הַרְבֵּה מְאֹד. וָאוֹמַר לַמֶּלֶךְ הַמֶּלֶךְ לְעוֹלָם יִחְיֶה מַדּוּעַ לֹא יֵרְעוּ פָנַי אֲשֶׁר הָעִיר בֵּית קִבְרוֹת אֲבוֹתַי חֲרֵבָה וּשְׁעָרֶיהָ אוּכְּלוּ בָאֵשׁ״.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Nehemiah told these** words **to the king in Nisan, as it is stated: “And it came to pass in the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king, that wine was before him, and I took up the wine and gave it to the king. Now I had not been sad before in his presence. And the king said to me: Why is your face sad, seeing that you are not sick? This is nothing else but sorrow of the heart. Then I was very much afraid, and I said to the king: Let the king live forever: Why should not my face be sad, when the city, the place of the tombs of my ancestors, lies waste, and its gates are consumed with fire?”** (Nehemiah 2:1–3).


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:6
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:6](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:6)

״וַיֹּאמֶר לִי הַמֶּלֶךְ עַל מַה זֶּה אַתָּה מְבַקֵּשׁ וָאֶתְפַּלֵּל אֶל אֱלֹהֵי הַשָּׁמָיִם. וָאוֹמַר לַמֶּלֶךְ אִם עַל הַמֶּלֶךְ טוֹב וְאִם יִיטַב עַבְדְּךָ לְפָנֶיךָ אֲשֶׁר תִּשְׁלָחֵנִי אֶל יְהוּדָה אֶל עִיר קִבְרוֹת אֲבוֹתַי וְאֶבְנֶנָּה. וַיֹּאמֶר לִי הַמֶּלֶךְ וְהַשֵּׁגַל יוֹשֶׁבֶת אֶצְלוֹ עַד מָתַי יִהְיֶה מַהֲלָכְךָ וּמָתַי תָּשׁוּב וַיִּיטַב לִפְנֵי הַמֶּלֶךְ וַיִּשְׁלָחֵנִי וָאֶתְּנָה לוֹ זְמָן״.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**“Then the king said to me: For what do you ask? So I prayed to the God of heaven. And I said to the king: If it please the king, and if your servant has found favor in your sight, that you would send me to Judea, to the city of the graves of my ancestors, that I may rebuild it. And the king said to me, the consort also sitting by him: For how long shall your journey be? And when will you return? So it pleased the king to send me; and I set him a time”** (Nehemiah 2:4–6).


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:7
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:7](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:7)

מֵתִיב רַב יוֹסֵף: ״בְּיוֹם עֶשְׂרִים וְאַרְבָּעָה לַחֹדֶשׁ בַּשִּׁשִּׁי בִּשְׁנַת שְׁתַּיִם לְדָרְיָוֶשׁ״, וּכְתִיב: ״בַּשְּׁבִיעִי בִּשְׁנַת שְׁתַּיִם בְּעֶשְׂרִים וְאֶחָד לַחֹדֶשׁ״. וְאִם אִיתָא — ״בַּשְּׁבִיעִי בִּשְׁנַת שָׁלֹשׁ״ מִיבְּעֵי לֵיהּ!

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Rav Yosef raised an objection** against the rule established by Rav Ḥisda that the years of gentile kings are counted from Tishrei from the verse that states: **“On the twenty-fourth day of the sixth month, in the second year of Darius the king”** (Haggai 1:15), **and it is written** immediately afterward: **“In the seventh month, in the second year, on the twenty-first day of the month,** the word of the Lord came by the prophet Haggai, saying” (Haggai 2:1). **And if it were so** that the years of gentile kings are counted from Tishrei, **what** the verse **needed** to state is: **In the seventh month in the third year,** as a new year had already started for him.


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:8
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:8](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:8)

אָמַר רַבִּי אֲבָהוּ: כּוֹרֶשׁ מֶלֶךְ כָּשֵׁר הָיָה, לְפִיכָךְ מָנוּ לוֹ כְּמַלְכֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Rabbi Abbahu said** in answer to this objection: **Cyrus was a virtuous king,** and **consequently** Haggai **counted** the years **of his** reign **like** those of **the kings of Israel,** i.e., from Nisan.


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:9
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:9](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:9)

מַתְקֵיף לַהּ רַב יוֹסֵף: חֲדָא — דְּאִם כֵּן קָשׁוּ קְרָאֵי אַהֲדָדֵי, דִּכְתִיב: ״וְשֵׁיצִיא בַּיְתָא דְנָא עַד יוֹם תְּלָתָא לִירַח אֲדָר דִּי הִיא שְׁנַת שֵׁית לְמַלְכוּת דָּרְיָוֶשׁ מַלְכָּא״, וְתַנְיָא: בְּאוֹתוֹ זְמַן לַשָּׁנָה הַבָּאָה עָלָה עֶזְרָא מִבָּבֶל וְגָלוּתוֹ עִמּוֹ, וּכְתִיב: ״וַיָּבֹא יְרוּשָׁלִַם בַּחֹדֶשׁ הַחֲמִישִׁי הִיא שְׁנַת הַשְּׁבִיעִית לַמֶּלֶךְ״, וְאִם אִיתָא — ״שְׁנַת הַשְּׁמִינִית״ מִיבְּעֵי לֵיהּ.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Rav Yosef strongly objects to this** explanation for two reasons: **One** objection is **that if** this is **so, the verses contradict each other, as it is written: “And this house was finished on the third of the month Adar, which was in the sixth year of the reign of Darius the king”** (Ezra 6:15), **and it is taught** in a *baraita*: **At that same time in the following year Ezra went up from Babylonia together with his** company of **exiles. And it is written** in the Bible: **“And he came to Jerusalem in the fifth month, which was in the seventh year of the king”** (Ezra 7:8). **And if it were so** that this king’s years were counted like those of the kings of Israel, **what** the verse **needed** to state is: Which was in **the eighth year** of the king.


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:10
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:10](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:10)

וְעוֹד: מִי דָּמֵי? הָתָם כּוֹרֶשׁ, הָכָא דָּרְיָוֶשׁ! תָּנָא: הוּא כּוֹרֶשׁ, הוּא דָּרְיָוֶשׁ, הוּא אַרְתַּחְשַׁסְתְּא. כּוֹרֶשׁ — שֶׁמֶּלֶךְ כָּשֵׁר הָיָה, אַרְתַּחְשַׁסְתְּא — עַל שֵׁם מַלְכוּתוֹ, וּמָה שְׁמוֹ — דָּרְיָוֶשׁ שְׁמוֹ.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**And further,** a second objection: **Are** Rav Yosef’s objection and Rabbi Abbahu’s resolution **comparable? There,** Rabbi Abbahu speaks of **Cyrus,** whereas **here,** the verses speak of **Darius,** and it was never said about Darius that he was a virtuous king. The Gemara explains: This is not difficult, as the Sages **taught** in a *baraita*: All three names are referring to the same person: **He is Cyrus; he is Darius;** and **he is** also **Artaxerxes.** He was called **Cyrus [*Koresh*] because he was a virtuous [*kasher*] king;** he was called **Artaxerxes after his kingdom,** i.e., this was his royal title; **and what was his** real **name? Darius was his name.**


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:11
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:11](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:11)

מִכׇּל מָקוֹם קַשְׁיָא! אָמַר רַבִּי יִצְחָק, לָא קַשְׁיָא: כָּאן קוֹדֶם שֶׁהֶחְמִיץ, כָּאן לְאַחַר שֶׁהֶחְמִיץ.

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
The Gemara notes: **In any case, it is difficult,** as in one place his years are counted from Nisan, whereas in another place they are counted from Tishrei. **Rabbi Yitzḥak said: This** is **not difficult,** as it can be explained as follows: **Here,** where his years are counted from Nisan like the kings of Israel, it speaks of him **before he became corrupt,** whereas **there,** where his years are counted from Tishrei, it speaks of him **after he became corrupt.**


###### Rosh Hashanah 3b:12
[Rosh Hashanah 3b:12](https://torahapp.org/share/book/Rosh%20Hashanah/r/3b:12)

מַתְקֵיף לַהּ רַב כָּהֲנָא: וּמִי הֶחְמִיץ? וְהָכְתִיב:

**William Davidson Edition - English:**
**Rav Kahana strongly objects to this** explanation: **Did he** really **become corrupt** after Ezra went to Eretz Yisrael? **But isn’t it written:**